Can we actually see black holes, or do we have to wait.

Technically we wouldn't be able to see a hole in space, or even so dense of matter no light can be reflected. Or can we Hawkins radiation. Can we prove this other than theory. Don't know. Other than infared light there is no other light coming from a black hole.

As a deffinition a black hole is a type of dead star that cannot emit light other than infared after it's pulsar dies out. A dark star which is a prelude to a black hole is a star so dense that cannot emit light. If a dark is not a dead star then it wouldn't be a black hole. Like a Quark star that is a dense neutron star. We cannot see a black hole other than in infared, but we can see a quasar where a number of stars are being sucked into a black hole. 

81,305 views 12 replies
Reply #1 Top

I think you need to go back and reread some of the science again. A black hole is a dead star that has collapsed to a singularity, a single point in space. Its gravity is so great that nothing can escape, not even infrared radiation. Hawking Radiation is a special case, and isn't really easy to detect anyway. We detect black holes by their effect on their surroundings: they are massive, so their gravity affects nearby stars. Like Yoda says, you just look for the center of the attraction, and there a black hole will you find. Also, their gravity will distort the images of stars behind them, and you can look for double-images to find black holes.

Contrast this with a pulsar, neutron star, and quark star. These are all less-massive dead stars that have not collapsed far enough to become a black hole. They can still be found using their gravity, and we can technically 'see' them, although they are very faint... except pulsars, which can be very loud [edit: read 'bright'] at certain frequencies!

As far as whether Black Holes exist: we are pretty damned sure they do. Too many observations indicate that they do, other theories predicts that they do, and the data match hypothetical calculations exactly within experimental error. Science cannot actually 'prove' anything, for philosophical reasons. Black Holes are at a state of understanding that scientists call 'theory,' but that isn't a theory in the way you mean it. To a scientist, a 'theory' is a reliable, usable piece of scientific understanding (what you would probably call a 'scientific fact'). What you call a 'theory,' we call a hypothesis. Black Holes are a matter of theory, meaning they are about as proven as they are going to get. If we are wrong about black holes, we are likely wrong about a whole lot of other significant things. That gives us more confidence, actually, since it means that all of our observations are in tune with one another.

There isn't much else we can do with black holes. If we get closer to them, we can do fun things like observe their tidal effect (your toes will be more attracted to the star than your head, for example), and we can drop things so that they fall forever into the event horizon. We can go around it and look at the gravitational lensing effect from every angle. But there isn't really anything you can do there that you can't already do from here with some effort. So waiting to find out more isn't a very productive idea...

Reply #2 Top

Quoting General, reply 1

Like Yoda says, you just look for the center of the attraction, and there a black hole will you find.
End of General's quote

Just to remind people...Yoda is a really bad excuse of a muppet...and not in any way real.

Embrace that and science will take on a whole new meaning/relevance...;)

Reply #3 Top

Quoting Jafo, reply 2

Just to remind people...Yoda is a really bad excuse of a muppet...and not in any way real.
End of Jafo's quote

And Jafo is a really obscure movie reference from whence to derive one's internet handle...

Isn't it a little racist to discount everything someone says because they happen to be a muppet? And what is this 'bad excuse?' I think he makes an excellent muppet! :)

Reply #4 Top

Actually, no.  It's an epithet he cherishes from his involvement in motor racing.

Reply #5 Top

He's miss-cast.  Muppets shouldn't be engaging in high-level sword fights with masters of the craft....and if he beats one then it really sets a low bar for the 'master' class.

I don't think calling a muppet a 'muppet' is racist....

And 'JAFO' existed a hell of a long time before 'Blue Thunder', so it ain't a 'movie reference' at all [except for the Hollywood groupie].  Think 'Air Force' ...;)

I met a 1-11 pilot back in '85 at the Adelaide F1 GP who was about to retire [20 years and 2 tours of Vietnam] and he said he had to introduce me to his 'Ex' [the polite term] and I said..."what...your JAFO?" to which he replied "oh...you mustn't call him that...you'll make him upset"..... His 'Ex' looked like Tom Cruise from Top Gun [except taller...like a grown-up], but we got on OK after I'd explained my role at the Grands Prix was Just Another Fucking Observer [aka Comms].

Reply #6 Top

Quoting Jafo, reply 5

looked like Tom Cruise from Top Gun [except taller...like a grown-up]
End of Jafo's quote

Laughing my ass off...

 

Quoting Jafo, reply 5

I don't think calling a muppet a 'muppet' is racist....
End of Jafo's quote

You wouldn't, now, would you... ? I mean, I'm not a muppet, but I have a lot of muppet friends, and I know it is a hard world when your skin is made of felt. The world is full of micro-aggressions, like people asking if they can play ping pong with your eyeballs, or if you'll open your mouth really wide so they can see your incredibly detailed uvula. They get really sick of that 'it's not easy being green' song too. They aren't all green, that is a stereotype!

Making a big deal out of a person because he lives his life with another person's hand crammed up his vent strikes me as the height of insensitivity! No one makes a big deal about who or what you sit on or how your mouthflap works, and no one points out the wires working your arms. I think you owe our muppet friends a little more consideration.

:rofl:

Quoting Jafo, reply 5

Muppets shouldn't be engaging in high-level sword fights with masters of the craft...
End of Jafo's quote

And that's not racist? What if you had a a little half-muppet child? Would you tell them they can't be a master swordsman? ;)

 

And, going waaaay off topic:

Quoting Jafo, reply 5

I met a 1-11 pilot back in '85 at the Adelaide 
End of Jafo's quote
 

Was that an Ozzie F-11[edit:1] pilot or an American (or a Brit... didn't they use the FB-111 for a while?)?

Reply #7 Top

Which is why 'BlindJAFO' was the perfect WB skin name for one done by Paul.  Still one of the best blinds ever IMHO.

Reply #8 Top

Quoting General, reply 6

Was that an Ozzie F-11[edit:1] pilot or an American (or a Brit... didn't they use the FB-111 for a while?)?

End of General's quote

Yes....that was an Aussie F111 pilot....did the dump and burn to light up the sky.

Must have been after '85....because the original one in 85 got into a whole lot of poo....popped the sound barrier just offshore from the city on the Tuesday before the GP........during [his] practise...;)

Broke a few windows.....

Reply #9 Top

Quoting General, reply 6

You wouldn't, now, would you... ? I mean, I'm not a muppet, but I have a lot of muppet friends, and I know it is a hard world when your skin is made of felt. The world is full of micro-aggressions, like people asking if they can play ping pong with your eyeballs, or if you'll open your mouth really wide so they can see your incredibly detailed uvula. They get really sick of that 'it's not easy being green' song too. They aren't all green, that is a stereotype!

Making a big deal out of a person because he lives his life with another person's hand crammed up his vent strikes me as the height of insensitivity! No one makes a big deal about who or what you sit on or how your mouthflap works, and no one points out the wires working your arms. I think you owe our muppet friends a little more consideration.
End of General's quote

Of course, if you have someone's arm firmly embedded up your clacker you've got more to worry about than a little name-calling...;)

Reply #10 Top

I don't think muppets are a different race, but a different species. So he's a speciesists. This is funny!

Reply #11 Top

Quoting admiralWillyWilber, reply 10

I don't think muppets are a different race, but a different species. So he's a speciesists. This is funny!
End of admiralWillyWilber's quote

 

OMG...it's specie-al discrimination!!!!!

 

As for 'way off topic' .....was this ever on one? ...;)

Don't blame me...I didn't bring up Yoda....and come to think of it....neither should have Lucas....;p

Reply #12 Top

Quoting Jafo, reply 11

I didn't bring up Yoda...
End of Jafo's quote

 

And thus, a new euphemism for vomiting was born... "bringing up Yoda..."