Add more starbase range logistical awareness?

Mystikmind

Join Date 06/2004

+20

This reminds me.... I always thought it was interesting how the tool tip recommends you send a survey ship with a constructor through a wormhole, but the AI never does it? Or do they?

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The Ai doesn't do either of those things. There's a lot of stuff the Ai should do, and doesn't, and does do that it shouldn't. Most of it is exploitable and should be fixed, especially in regards to diplomacy trades like useless bases and junk ships.

The constructor through the wormhole is more of a human ingenuity thing. We primarily do it to get access to more anomalies - or hope to - it's too random to be reliable for anything else. The Ai doesn't have that level of commitment to anomalies, so it doesn't do it. Should it? Probably. But it doesn't hurt it by not doing so. Stuff like not having more than 1 transport in a fleet, having limits on attacks per turn, not using the pop slider, building too many asteroid mines, buying old useless ships and bases - that stuff hurts it a lot more.

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Mystikmind

Join Date 06/2004

+20

Quoting hfxnikolai,

reply 2

The Ai doesn't do either of those things. There's a lot of stuff the Ai should do, and doesn't, and does do that it shouldn't. Most of it is exploitable and should be fixed, especially in regards to diplomacy trades like useless bases and junk ships.

The constructor through the wormhole is more of a human ingenuity thing. We primarily do it to get access to more anomalies - or hope to - it's too random to be reliable for anything else. The Ai doesn't have that level of commitment to anomalies, so it doesn't do it. Should it? Probably. But it doesn't hurt it by not doing so. Stuff like not having more than 1 transport in a fleet, having limits on attacks per turn, not using the pop slider, building too many asteroid mines, buying old useless ships and bases - that stuff hurts it a lot more.

I reckon it would be amazingly more interesting if the AI did use constructors with anomalies, just imagine how that could mix things up?!!

Those other things i think the difficulty level is the perfect solution to compensate for it.

I think the AI needs just 1 transport per fleet in order to ensure the fleet is as powerful as possible because otherwise with allot of transports, the player will be seeking to intercept that fleet and have a greater advantage in terms of combat ships. Besides, the AI does multiple fleets very well, so it suits its abilities i think?

What the AI does need to do with transports, is comprehend how well defended the planet is resistance wise, not just ships

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Agreed, ai with constructors and anomalies would be interesting. But you'd end up with all sorts of starbases in your territory that you have (currently) no way of getting rid of short of buying or war. You'd definitely have to give players the "remove starbase" option we get from the Ai all the time in order for that to work.

Then again, on higher difficulties, the Ai is unaffected by FoW, so it knows where all the anomalies are anyway. Humans using constructors with surveryors and wormholes is the counterbalance to that I guess.

I agree with you it needs to do "pre invasion math" - but if that math leads to the conclusion that it needs 6 troops to take that planet, it should have the ability to do so - either by loading 1 ship with sufficient troops, or bringing more than 1 ship in a fleet. Currently it can't do either.

If the Ai is limited to 1 transport per fleet, and can't use the population slider, it can send a max of 2.5 troops per invasion attempt. This makes it ridiculously, laughably easy to make planets invasion proof. Some people may like that I guess....but I prefer to play with the same sets of rules on both sides.

As for 1 transport per fleet, it's up to your play style I guess. For the same reason you suggested (fleet strength) I make my attack fleet without transports, clear the way, then bring in a fleet of 2-3 transports with guards in the fleet to protect it. I'm not using the fleet with the transport to clear the defenders. From what I've seen the Ai does it this way as well, so putting 2 transports in an invasion fleet wouldn't have much of an impact.

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Mystikmind

Join Date 06/2004

+20

Quoting hfxnikolai,

reply 4

Agreed, ai with constructors and anomalies would be interesting. But you'd end up with all sorts of starbases in your territory that you have (currently) no way of getting rid of short of buying or war. You'd definitely have to give players the "remove starbase" option we get from the Ai all the time in order for that to work.

Then again, on higher difficulties, the Ai is unaffected by FoW, so it knows where all the anomalies are anyway. Humans using constructors with surveryors and wormholes is the counterbalance to that I guess.

I agree with you it needs to do "pre invasion math" - but if that math leads to the conclusion that it needs 6 troops to take that planet, it should have the ability to do so - either by loading 1 ship with sufficient troops, or bringing more than 1 ship in a fleet. Currently it can't do either.

If the Ai is limited to 1 transport per fleet, and can't use the population slider, it can send a max of 2.5 troops per invasion attempt. This makes it ridiculously, laughably easy to make planets invasion proof. Some people may like that I guess....but I prefer to play with the same sets of rules on both sides.

As for 1 transport per fleet, it's up to your play style I guess. For the same reason you suggested (fleet strength) I make my attack fleet without transports, clear the way, then bring in a fleet of 2-3 transports with guards in the fleet to protect it. I'm not using the fleet with the transport to clear the defenders. From what I've seen the Ai does it this way as well, so putting 2 transports in an invasion fleet wouldn't have much of an impact.

Interesting....

I remember from the dread lords campaign in Galciv2, my worst nightmare was when the dread lords send a troop transport with escorts!!! but i was usually prepared for it by keeping plenty of fast transports handy and suck the targeted planet dry of population before they arrive. Then returning after getting some reasonable combat fleet in the area.

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Quoting hfxnikolai,

reply 2

The Ai doesn't do either of those things. There's a lot of stuff the Ai should do, and doesn't, and does do that it shouldn't. Most of it is exploitable and should be fixed, especially in regards to diplomacy trades like useless bases and junk ships.

The constructor through the wormhole is more of a human ingenuity thing. We primarily do it to get access to more anomalies - or hope to - it's too random to be reliable for anything else. The Ai doesn't have that level of commitment to anomalies, so it doesn't do it. Should it? Probably. But it doesn't hurt it by not doing so. Stuff like not having more than 1 transport in a fleet, having limits on attacks per turn, not using the pop slider, building too many asteroid mines, buying old useless ships and bases - that stuff hurts it a lot more.

Why are we talking about an AI take an interest into tape Constructor with Survey ship just to have it teleport out into nowhere when they are neglect to collect their sodding anomaly in their own territory? If they can't/won't cleanup an anomaly in/near their zone then i don't hope they will have enough processing power to process that it should stick Constructor with Survey and send both into wormhole.

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Mystikmind

Join Date 06/2004

+20

Quoting FreedomFighterEx,

reply 6

Quoting hfxnikolai,

reply 2

The Ai doesn't do either of those things. There's a lot of stuff the Ai should do, and doesn't, and does do that it shouldn't. Most of it is exploitable and should be fixed, especially in regards to diplomacy trades like useless bases and junk ships.

The constructor through the wormhole is more of a human ingenuity thing. We primarily do it to get access to more anomalies - or hope to - it's too random to be reliable for anything else. The Ai doesn't have that level of commitment to anomalies, so it doesn't do it. Should it? Probably. But it doesn't hurt it by not doing so. Stuff like not having more than 1 transport in a fleet, having limits on attacks per turn, not using the pop slider, building too many asteroid mines, buying old useless ships and bases - that stuff hurts it a lot more.

Why are we talking about an AI take an interest into tape Constructor with Survey ship just to have it teleport out into nowhere when they are neglect to collect their sodding anomaly in their own territory? If they can't/won't cleanup an anomaly in/near their zone then i don't hope they will have enough processing power to process that it should stick Constructor with Survey and send both into wormhole.

Not just wormholes.... the AI even leaves yellow diamond anomalies in its territory! I like to think it does that because it is in such a hurry to rush off and flog all the anomalies in front of player survey ships!! The trick is.... never keep your survey ship going in a straight line ..... ever notice how whenever you do that, you don't find anything for long periods of time?

Anyway, more likely the AI HAS claimed all the anomalies in its territory and moved on, then when you get the anomaly re-spawn event, the AI's survey ships are all too far away chasing other anomalies..... that is what i really suspect is happening? And Also the AI will not give priority to wormholes when it has more valuable anomalies to chase.

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Yeah. Once i found the like 3 relics anomaly within their ZOC and they just left it sit like that. I swoop in and rush 3 tech, felt so OP. Funny enough that AI love trying to hijack your anomaly instead of clearing their own. Civ5's AI doing better at cleaning up an ancient ruin (anomaly) than GC3's AI.

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Mystikmind

Join Date 06/2004

+20

Quoting FreedomFighterEx,

reply 8

Yeah. Once i found the like 3 relics anomaly within their ZOC and they just left it sit like that. I swoop in and rush 3 tech, felt so OP. Funny enough that AI love trying to hijack your anomaly instead of clearing their own. Civ5's AI doing better at cleaning up an ancient ruin (anomaly) than GC3's AI.

Just 3?

I regularly find them in AI territory, even at very late stages of the game i am still finding them in AI territory.

Sometimes i will even see three or four AI survey ships following each other and speeding right past a free tech anomaly..... i see their ships and think i wont reach the anomaly before them.... nope, they are far too interested in rushing off to flog other peoples anomalies.

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Horemvore

Join Date 08/2009

+123

The AI ignoring Anomolies is due to them been guarded by pirates, AI and pirates dont get along, they avoid them like the plague which give the player and advantage, a big one.

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