Ship combat mechanics - looking for some info/advice

from GalCiv3 Forums

I've done some searching on this, but haven't found much info that is helping me understand how the ship combat does the lose/win calculations.  My apologies if this is covered in another post that I have yet to dig up, so please bear with me.

I'm not particularly adept at the game, so any hints are welcome!

So, I recently played a game where mid/late game it seemed that I had the numerical advantage in ship combat against an AI opponent, but the combat results always ended massively in the AI's favor.

For example:  

I had fleets of large ships with total numbers (these will be approximations here) of:  8 ships (~2500hp total), 0 beam attack, 0 missile attack, ~1000 massdriv attack, ~400 shield, ~1000 point def, ~400 armor.

The AI had fleets of medium ships: 12-16 ships (~1700hp), 0-10 beam attack, 1000 missile attack, 0-10 massdriv attack, 0 shield, 0 point def, 300 armor.

By the numbers, I figured I had these battles won, but routinely would only barely win or lose.  Am I missing something overly easy that would have such a massive impact on ship battles?  Is it better to have tons of smaller ships?  Do things like jamming and accuracy make a huge difference that aren't necessarily reflected in the numbers?

Thanks in advance for any insight. 

14,867 views 6 replies
Reply #1 from GalCiv3 Forums Top

Missiles have a much longer range, at a guess, your losing a fair percentage of your ships before they even get to fire. Watching the battles is a good way to find out whats going though.

Reply #2 from GalCiv3 Forums Top

What were the fleet roles for each ship on each side. That could make a huge difference.

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Reply #3 from Sins Forums Top

Are you judging the actual battle numbers here, or are those stats you gave based on what the fleet was comprised of on main map?  If they had a few sets of fighters not included in those numbers, it's a pretty major shift in balance from what you're expecting.

 

Mass drivers can be horribly inaccurate depending on research/modules, and because they had smaller ships you could also be losing pretty heavy amounts of damage to overkill by comparison to them.  You should always have fighters or smaller ships for damage absorption if you're fighting similar power fleets.  It wouldn't take much in support systems to swing those numbers.  You're way ahead of them, but 1k PD vs 300 armor isn't as big a gap as it looks like if the armor is more durable, doesn't get hit nearly as often, etc.  There is also defense shredding equipment in the game, if they had penetration boosts up, your 1k PD was worth squat.

Reply #4 from GalCiv3 Forums Top

Jamming and carrier modules can make a difference, but in my recent experience, the AI didn't really use those (unless they are thalans or torians who ge 20% and 30% of jamming from techs and traits). Same for all the support modules like full damage against armor.

My best guess: Mercenary ships. Some of them have stuff like take 75% less damage from kinetics, 30% jamming and accuracy, or boost missile attack of entire fleet.

Apart from that, if you play  kinetics, you probably also use rapid reload, which reduces your accuracy (down to 65%), an accuracy booster is most definitly worth it for you. Some thrusters might also be worth it, they reduce the free salvoes you are taking from a longer range opponent.

The attack numbers don't reflect the attack cooldown and range. 1000 missile attack is damage done every 8 seconds (changes depending on ship modules and upgrades), 1000 kinetic attack is done every 4 seconds (2 with rapid reload) and therefore quite a bit better.

Take a look at the battle viewer what happens.

On the topic of jamming: the AI doesn't counter with taargetting boosters. If you can get up to like 60+% jamming you can actually start replacing your defenses with more pewpew. The combination of repair and high jamming values in particulare can be very potent.

Reply #5 from GalCiv3 Forums Top

In response to a question above, my numbers are from the main map only.  I haven't been watching the fights, and that obviously is a mistake based on what you all have been suggesting.  It makes sense at this point to help find out what may be going on in a more granular way.

Many thanks for the replies and insight.  I appreciate it.

The takeaway is that I was being entirely too lazy about how I go about this.  My thought process was x>y=win for x, but it looks like there are many different things to think about when it comes time for ship design.

As an example, I had no idea that ship roles in a fleet would impact things in a significant way (I thought it was more for flavor), but that was mentioned above, so I need to do more reading about it.  Things others mentioned like the range, rapid reload, fleet composition also look like they make a huge difference.

Rather than get frustrated that larger numbers aren't winning overwhelmingly against smaller numbers, I need to change my outlook and invest more time into good ship/fleet design that counters an enemy fleet specifically, rather than just thinking about brute force/larger numbers.

Reply #6 from GalCiv3 Forums Top

Good response and I am glad you took people's suggestions to heart.  It is not all that complicated a combat system, but things like range, accuracy, evasion, and rate of fire do make a lot of difference, subtleties that you get to judge on beyond the basic numbers.  In your case it sounds like weapons range is a big factor.  Knowing about that will give you a big advantage.  In my games, I like to supplement my ships with a support ship that has fleet wide augments.  Boosting your particular weapons while nerfing their particular defenses is great.  I am also very fond of the fleet repair modules.  There should be enough options for you to find your own style of combat, or multiple styles.  

And watch the battle viewer!  Yes, it is informative, but mostly it's about blowing up space ships. ;)  I am hoping they realize that for planet invasions.  I want buildings falling and terrain being wiped out as well as invasion forces clashing, things that cinematically reflect the overall results.  I'm seeing a sequence of cinematics with rendered versions of the improvement buildings and key units exploding to simulate damages and population/soldier loss levels, the latest report from the Galactic Network News about The Battle for Hoth IV!  Action oriented eye candy for everybody!

But anyway, good luck on your battles.