[0.80] bugs and suggestions regarding starbases

from GalCiv3 Forums

Some bugs and suggestions:

----

Starbases stealing constructors. It is possible for multiple starbases directly ordering constructors to get fewer constructors than what was ordered and for other starbases to get more than what was ordered. I call this constructor stealing. After many tests, what seems to happen is the shipyard will give the flight plan of next constructor to be built to the constructor that was just built. If a constructor is the last item in the build queue, then things work as they should. So if you order 4 constructors to one starbase and then another 4 to another starbase, the first starbase will get 3 constructors because 4th got the flight plan of the 5th constructor. So the end result is the first starbase gets 3 constructors (4-1) while the second gets 5 constructors (4+1).

To examine this problem a little bit further, if you had a ship (maybe a scout or another constructor) in front of the first constructor ordered, it will get the flight plan of the first ordered constructor. So a single starbase would wind up with an extra ship when everything is said and done. Likewise, if a ship is placed at the end of the queue, then the ship in front of it will adopt the flight plan of the ship that comes after it. So a single starbase would be short of a constructor.

----

While the fact that we can now directly order constructors from starbases, some people have pointed out that you can only order the normal constructors. Basically you are forced to use whatever constructor the game designs for you instead of using whatever model you have designed for the job. Your design ships could be a constructor ship stripped down of everything that is not the hull or constructor module, or it could even be something with multiple constructor modules. Regardless of how well you have designed it, the starbases can't be made to order it. Of course, if your techs improve to the point where you get more expensive parts and more miniaturization, then the normal constructors will get more expensive and hence slow things down.

The only way to avoid this problem (at this time) is to opt out of using the constructor ordering mechanism from the starbase and upgrade your starbase like you could in beta 4.

----

Something that has came up when I was using order constructors (a lot of it) is, it is difficult to judge how many constructors you will need to fully upgrade a starbase, or just upgrade select modules. The problem is that not all modules are revealed at once. Many modules are unlocked once you spend a constructor point to install the prerequisite. Unless you taken the time to count up exactly how many constructor points you need for the configuration you want, you are stuck guessing how many constructors you will need to order.

There are a few ways to fix this. First off, you could make it possible to see all modules that can be unlocked by installing a specific module. For instance, if I look at the economic starbase upgrade, I would like to be able to tell that I could get 3 manufacturing upgrades and 2 morale upgrades. I could then decide that I need to order 5 constructors. Alternatively (or to complement other options), we could get the tools to tell the starbase how to upgrade itself and allow it to order constructors as needed. For instance, it could be told to automatically upgrade all manufacturing and morale modules when possible.

GalCiv 2 had the ability to automatically upgrade starbases if they got constructors. I something like that or better would be nice to have.

2,088 views 5 replies
Reply #1 from GalCiv3 Forums Top

Even with bugs the new system is better than nothing but it needs some fixing.

You build a star base and request constructors. I am not yet certain this is working exactly right but I think it might be okay. I am not sure where the constructors are pulled from but I do know that it is not just constructors. Any support ship, Colony, freighter scout, any ship with the support level is going to the star base. This needs to be fixed. It also seems like it keeps sending more that requested but I am still not sure about this.

They seem to be on the right track hopefull they will get the bugs out of it

Reply #2 from GalCiv3 Forums Top

Am I doing a bad job of explaining things the past few days?

I didn't say that the new system was bad, I actually like most of the changes. What I was doing was being focused on the stuff that I thought need fixing, but it seems that I came across as being overly negative.

I'll go check if all types of support ships are pulled if the conditions are right. I don't think I notice much already built ships being pulled because I use things that prevent the pull. Things like the guard command will prevent otherwise idle constructors from being pulled (I tested it). As such, I've seen a lot of constructors being added to the shipyard build queue so I've been studying that stuff.

WindowBlinds - Free yourself of the default settings, customize your desktop.
Reply #3 from GalCiv3 Forums Top

Lord, Lord, I did not intend to imply that you said or even thought the system was bad. Your intent was clear, apparently mine was not.

My initial comment was independent of anything you said and just my opinion that the system flawed as it is is better than nothing.

I have let my interest in the game make me too willing to add my 2 cents on too many topics. Rereading my post I find nothing of any particular value in my comments and all I managed to do is apparently offend you. Sorry, I'll try not to let it happen again.

Reply #4 from GalCiv3 Forums Top

i would also like to add my 2c

first a comment this system has the potential to be good, its just not there yet

second another bug possibly

the constructor requested is always pulled from the nearest starbase, not the most effective starbase.
if i have a starbase sitting 10 tiles away with 1 item in que that will be done in 2 turns.
and another starbase at 5 tiles  with 50+ turns of military orders .
the constructor will be ordered from the shipyard with 50+ turns of ships in line simply because it is closer.

 

some thoughts on this

it should check build que +travel time to determine the fastest build time,

i should be able to designate a shipyard to be un-available for constructors or always-available for constructors

 

Reply #5 from GalCiv3 Forums Top

@ Franco fx

Don't worry about it. I was more confused by several people (you included) than anything else.

----

As for shipyards, I had something in mind, but I was having trouble articulating my thoughts on it at the time. Yes, which shipyards that get the build orders do matter. It could be for reasons such as one shipyard that already has many ships in queue while another does not, so being able to choose a different shipyard could be used to find one that doesn't have a big waiting list. I also saw someone suggest that they wanted to be able to use multiple shipyards at once so all the required constructors could be built faster.

I would like to add that other factors like not having a secure route could play a part. If you somehow manage to flank an enemy empire (maybe someone surrendered to you), you probably don't want your constructors to be traveling through that empire's space. You could easily lose constructors that way.

Maybe a shipyard is setup to build expensive ships, far more expensive than constructors, so there would be wasted manufacturing points. You can only build 1 ship per turn, so there isn't much good to use a shipyard that has the industrial ability to produce 2 or 3 constructors per turn (since you are still limited to just the 1 ship per turn).