Ideas for combat modules for ships.

Just thought I'd trow this out there. Something I suggested a long time ago during DA. To go beyond the rock-scissor-paper combat I thought it would be great to have modules that could be put on ships to aid in combat. Things to add to ships that in addition to sounding cool would make a difference to the ship's fighting or even have a fleet-wide effect. Sizes would have to be weighed against their usefulness.

For example, one might be something called "targeting computers" which would give a higher hitting percentage or damage. Another might be a Command Bridge that gives a higher attack for the fleet and "Maneuvering Thrusters" that have the potential to make enemy shots miss. Or a shield generator that can extend shields over smaller ships in the fleet but not have enough hull space left to have weapons of its own. Of course the list can go on, but that's the basic idea.

In all I just thought that something like these could add some variability or unpredictability to a battle where its not just the fleet with the biggest guns that necessarily wins. It would make players really think about their ships more.

Anyone???

 

 

4,595 views 10 replies
Reply #1 Top

Anti boarding parties troops so ship can not be taken by pirates or others.

Reply #2 Top

There are already plans for this. This is exactly what the support class of ships will be for, but we won't get to see them until beta 3.

Reply #3 Top

Cool.  I want to go back to the Galciv 2 boards and find my old post.

Reply #4 Top

Kooky ideas, based on WWII tech (and a tiny bit of SE3).

  • drop tank, one-shot range extension.
    • They give +range (maybe +6 in GC3), but -agility while equipped.
    • You drain them as dry as you can, then drop them before combat.  This effectively gives you +range for "zero" cost ...
    • ... except that constantly discarding a squadron's-worth of tanks every sortie gradually costs you in lost tanks and wasted fuel.  That transforms the conflict into not just a tech duel, but a resource-stockpile duel, so the richer side can convert resource-advantage directly into combat-advantage (which is historically accurate).
    • Corollary: If you never dogfight, you bring them home empty and lose nothing.

As a tech, it'd be moderately early and very cheap.  As a resource drain, it'd be mild -- certainly less than the cost of losing one unit, and a small fraction of the ordnance they're going to deliver.  But it's not zero.  This concept may/not generalize to spacefaring ship warfare.  (It seems to persist into the 21st century: we still equip fighters with conformal drop tanks, e.g. to enable F-15s to cross the Atlantic non-stop with no tanker buddy.  The one with the tanks is the tanker for his flight.)

SE3/SE4 had some ship components that explored this niche (but really poorly thought out):

  • [SE3,4] emergency speed, one-shot component (SE* models this as: right-click to access component's command menu; usage destroys component, like normal ship damage).  Adds +2 squares movement to the ship for 1 turn (where normal movement is 8-15 hexes).  Use at most 1 per turn.

That's completely worthless; it's not worth the opportunity cost of eating up 1 uber-precious component slot.  So we players voted with our "feet", and unanimously relegated this category of component to the dunsel bin.  I cannot imagine, to this day, a (legitimate) scenario where such a component pays off.  Even the AIs agreed: zero of their own designs included it.  SE5 quietly omitted (or extincted) these components.  I'll have whatever the SE3 designers had when they thought this up.

  • (abuse) self-repair infinite ship.  In SE4, numerous techs gave components that were "one-shot" at medium-low tech, and "infinite for free" at extremely high techs.  In early mid-game, you could design a ship large enough to carry a typical combat stack, a repair bay (which is just a component), and 1 each of several "one-shot" components.  Every turn, you use every component once, and then it repairs itself :grin:   This broke the game: the ship basically gained permanent +speed, +other stuff, infinite range, and oh-by-the-way it could heal any battle damage.  The first one you built simply dominated the entire map.  Man those were fun ships -- but they trumped the game so bad they made it just-not-fun, and I ceased SE4.

It may have had a parallel in old piston-engine tech.

  • copper wire, one-shot emergency speed.
    • Restriction: only to air-cooled radial piston engines (blunt stubby noses, c.f. Corsair, Hellcat, Thunderbolt).
    • Does not apply to water-cooled inline piston engines (tapered noses, c.f. Lightning, Mustang, Spitfire).
    • Normal in-flight cooling is from airflow over the pistons.  In your engine compartment is a reservoir of water.  Across the upper limit of your throttle is a copper wire.
    • In extreme duress, you ram throttle through the wire, breaking it.  This punctures reservoir, dousing water over the pistons.  For ~90 seconds, you get +10% hp (horsepower) beyond max military power, which sometimes lets you pull away from equally-fast enemy fighters (and open a gap sufficient to turn 180, as needed).
    • This may crack the cylinders, and generally damage or ruin the engine.  After it returns you home safely k1 , maybe you replace the engine, and your discolored shoes.

This is an anachronism of propeller tech.  Jets and turboprops don't have anything equivalent.  (Jets have their own variant, called afterburners.)

For interstellar ship engines, we obviously have artistic license to make them any way we want.  So the decision rests on game-play or storytelling issues:

  • Are there interesting trade-offs?  (e.g. drop tanks for resource-dueling may suit a game that emphasizes resources)
  • Does it add cognitive burden?  (more micro is really bad)  Can we abstract it away?  (e.g. just make it a tax on your resources)
  • Does it add nonesuch benefits?  (e.g. heroic/legendary escape could leverage RPG or singular-figure game systems)

These ideas might not fit GC* at all.  Most of these concerns are intrinsically small-unit level in scope, e.g. they matter very much to 1 pilot at a time, or to a squadron, or maybe to a theater air boss, but probably make no difference at a Joint Chiefs level of planning.  GC3 abstracts everything planetside, but ships are still modeled individually, so there's room to explore this mechanism.

The high-level idea is that a tech doesn't just give you a flat bonus, but creates a new sideflow(?) of resource-to-bonus, for some input resource R and transform function f(R).  (Exemplar: Enable Tourism +1, which creates a new sideflow of zoc-to-income.)  Then you must have R, and actually commit it to buy your bonus.  Much later on, you'd get a tech that just trumps any such bonus, at which point you may or may not upgrade everything.

Maybe this idea is best in slow-tech games, where war-duration is much shorter than tech-creep, so that there is a need to wield your strengths outside of your tech.  If you're going to reach the high tech before your slow weenies even reach Kona's backfield, then this idea is just a big detour.

 

Reply #5 Top

Also the game already has existing mechanics, though they probably don't play out in battles yet: Weapon range and combat speed.

Reply #6 Top

Plus GC2 had bonus area of effect (Zone of Control) weapon and defence  modules - stella avenger/defender plus the xalax and Zalax something modules and we had warp bubble modules for fleet speed boosts...

Reply #7 Top

Lol there's targeting computers already! All of this has been in since galciv2! :p

 

DARCA. ;)

Reply #8 Top

i never got TA  :(  i guess that's where these things are.   What did the targeting computers and zone of control modules do?

Reply #9 Top

Quoting CaptainYar, reply 8

i never got TA  :(  i guess that's where these things are.   What did the targeting computers and zone of control modules do?
End of CaptainYar's quote

Stella Avenger size 5 gave 20% bonus to damage in your own areas and the defender gave a 20% bonus to defences,whereas the xalax (xdm) size variable with hull size) gave a fleet a 25% defence bonus over the whole map and the zalax (ZDM) would give a 30% defence bonus over the whole map. warp bubble modules would give +1,2,3 speed bonuses to the fleet that they were in (Bonuses dont stack) the most I could do is build a huge hull with both a warp 3 bubble on it with a xdm on it so the fleet had 25%+ defences and a speed boost of +3 But then I'm not the most experienced of players.

Reply #10 Top

I'd like to see the equivalent of a fleet train, modules that allow all ships in a fleet an extension for logistics and range, plus faster repair rate.