Thalans

An impossible Race? Or a secret well kept?

from GalCiv3 Forums

The race we know of as Thalans is thought to be one of the keys of the story that unfolds through each GC episode/game/expansion. However which story would that be, exactly? Supposedly we know of Draginol the Mithrilar possibly destroying the universe as is known in GC. 

And the Thalans are here to prevent it. I had a problem with that statement ever since I read about it. And I just realized what the problem is...it's a logical leap. Thalans are from the future supposedly, from a parallel dimension from which they time travelled to our own(GC one, that is). But how can you witness the destruction of something and set yourself a goal to prevent it, and do what Thalans did, supposedly time travelling and orchestrating plans to create a time paradox(going back to change their future), if you haven't actually survived?

So, we know little about Thalans and one of the things we know is that they haven't evolved yet in GC universe(we haven't seen a proto-Thalan race yet anywhere in GC Cosmos), so where do they really come from? Are they some kind of deity? Are they an abnormality of the Universe, not supposed to happen at all? Are they liars? How do we know anything they say is true? Just cause they say it? For all we know, they could have spread rumours about GC Universe destroyed by humans cause it fits their plans in some form. Maybe the Universe is not destroyed and the 5th Mithrilar was created as a Universe healing itself method.(Brad himself told once that one man's destroy could be another's transform.)

Maybe they, in fact, are the bad guys of the unravelling situation and just focus on humans so we can't see what they are actually doing. Maybe they have something to do with the Dread Lords and they weren't even created before the final chapter of the intra-arnor conflict. Maybe the remaining Mithrilar(not Draginol, there was one more survivor if I counted well) created them for some reason. Maybe they're related to Yor in some way. They don't look good guys to me, in any case. More like predators living in shadows till the time for their strike comes.

(Well we know the details so far are from what Brad said from time to time, but since that was only vaguely covered either by Brad or in game, maybe Brad didnt want to reveal all the cards yet. Maybe he wanted to leave some room for surprises, I don't know. The fact that Thalans are so cryptic is fishy to me however.)

So what are your thoughts?

56,603 views 20 replies
Reply #1 from GalCiv3 Forums Top

Thalans are from the future supposedly, from a parallel dimension from which they time travelled to our own(GC one, that is). But how can you witness the destruction of something and set yourself a goal to prevent it, and do what Thalans did, supposedly time travelling and orchestrating plans to create a time paradox(going back to change their future), if you haven't actually survived?
End of quote

I think you misread something. The Thalan claim to be from a dying universe, not from a fully destroyed one.

Case in point, here are some excerpts from the description of two techs in the Thalan tech tree of GalCiv 2:

Temporal Mechanics 

"Our universe exists in 11 dimensions. There are also a near-infinite number of universes that are connected to each of those 11 dimensions. Destroying a universe is a non-trivial effort. And yet, somehow, the primitive species of this space time have managed to do just that. Specifically, the species known as humans, in their near-future, manage to create such utter destruction that the resulting ruin feeds upon itself and permeates all of creation throughout every dimension.
The only bright side to this is that this destruction travels at the speed of light. The downside is that the destruction moves at the speed of light through folded space which means it will engulf the universe in far less than the 13 billion of their years that it would otherwise require."

Xeno Colonization

"In our time, in a dying universe, the ability to exist on the surface of planets in an unprotected environment is unthinkable." 

Plus, here is an excerpt from the the Thalan entry in the Databanks:

"The Thalan are a large insectoid race that claim to come from the near future. In that future, humans have destroyed most of the life in the galaxy and so damaged the fabric of space that the universe itself is beginning to collapse upon itself. The Thalan claim to have come back in time to stop the human “crusade.”"

As for the Thalan themselves, I think they are exactly what they claim to be. The source of Brad's "one man’s “destroy” is another man’s “transform”" doesn't leave much room for doubt:

"The Thalan, in fact, are actually a race of beings from a parallel universe who have figured out the means to travel to other universes and managed to enter our universe at a point before the humans destroyed the universe"

Reply #2 from GalCiv3 Forums Top

Quoting Gaunathor, reply 1
"The Thalan, in fact, are actually a race of beings from a parallel universe who have figured out the means to travel to other universes and managed to enter our universe at a point before the humans destroyed the universe"
End of Gaunathor's quote

WOW. If that isn't a seriously convoluted sentence. Notice the mix of the singular and plural form of the word "universe". And, if you destroy one universe, do you destroy all of them at once? This sentence is phrased as if you do.

CursorFX - Customize your Windows cursor
Reply #3 from GalCiv3 Forums Top

There is only Fate and Sovereignty. There is one universe. ( though all "this" might just be the equivalent to a solar flare. )

There is no choice, only what you choose.

The universe is all things. And there is only one.

Reply #4 from GalCiv3 Forums Top

Cheers for the shout out Darca, but I'm just one man O:)

Reply #5 from GalCiv3 Forums Top

Quoting Gaunathor, reply 1


Thalans are from the future supposedly, from a parallel dimension from which they time travelled to our own(GC one, that is). But how can you witness the destruction of something and set yourself a goal to prevent it, and do what Thalans did, supposedly time travelling and orchestrating plans to create a time paradox(going back to change their future), if you haven't actually survived?

I think you misread something. The Thalan claim to be from a dying universe, not from a fully destroyed one.

Case in point, here are some excerpts from the description of two techs in the Thalan tech tree of GalCiv 2:

Temporal Mechanics 

"Our universe exists in 11 dimensions. There are also a near-infinite number of universes that are connected to each of those 11 dimensions. Destroying a universe is a non-trivial effort. And yet, somehow, the primitive species of this space time have managed to do just that. Specifically, the species known as humans, in their near-future, manage to create such utter destruction that the resulting ruin feeds upon itself and permeates all of creation throughout every dimension.
The only bright side to this is that this destruction travels at the speed of light. The downside is that the destruction moves at the speed of light through folded space which means it will engulf the universe in far less than the 13 billion of their years that it would otherwise require."

Xeno Colonization

"In our time, in a dying universe, the ability to exist on the surface of planets in an unprotected environment is unthinkable." 

Plus, here is an excerpt from the the Thalan entry in the Databanks:

"The Thalan are a large insectoid race that claim to come from the near future. In that future, humans have destroyed most of the life in the galaxy and so damaged the fabric of space that the universe itself is beginning to collapse upon itself. The Thalan claim to have come back in time to stop the human “crusade.”"

As for the Thalan themselves, I think they are exactly what they claim to be. The source of Brad's "one man’s “destroy” is another man’s “transform”" doesn't leave much room for doubt:

"The Thalan, in fact, are actually a race of beings from a parallel universe who have figured out the means to travel to other universes and managed to enter our universe at a point before the humans destroyed the universe"
End of Gaunathor's quote

 

I desperately need to know where you get all your quotations from; you seriously have up in a few seconds. Doesn't matter where it's from, or who said it, you always have it.

Do you have some huge array of post-it notes somewhere? Are you eidetic? Do you take the general rule "Copy everything interesting into notepad" one huge step further?

 

+1 Loading…
Reply #6 from GalCiv3 Forums Top

Quoting ParagonRenegade, reply 5
Do you take the general rule "Copy everything interesting into notepad" one huge step further?
End of ParagonRenegade's quote

I never thought of doing that. It would actually save me a lot of time. Good idea. k1

Reply #7 from GalCiv3 Forums Top

Give Gaunathor some sort of job here with a remuneration, he's an encyclopedia. Maybe a fedora with Stardock embroidered in it.

Reply #8 from GalCiv3 Forums Top

Quoting Gaunathor, reply 6


Quoting ParagonRenegade, reply 5Do you take the general rule "Copy everything interesting into notepad" one huge step further?

I never thought of doing that. It would actually save me a lot of time. Good idea.
End of Gaunathor's quote

You didn't answer my question, sly dog.

Reply #9 from GalCiv3 Forums Top

Quoting ParagonRenegade, reply 8
You didn't answer my question, sly dog.
End of ParagonRenegade's quote

You didn't really expect an answer from me, did you? ;)

Well, okay, here's a hint:

Quoting Gaunathor, reply 4
All in all, I'm the lore-fanatic in the community. In my opinion, you can never add too much of the lore to the game. I also wrote a mod for TotA, in order to fix the remaining bugs (as far as I can), and address some of the balancing- and lore-issues
End of Gaunathor's quote

It probably won't answer your question completely, but it should explain my post in this thread.

Reply #10 from GalCiv3 Forums Top

Quoting Gaunathor, reply 1


Thalans are from the future supposedly, from a parallel dimension from which they time travelled to our own(GC one, that is). But how can you witness the destruction of something and set yourself a goal to prevent it, and do what Thalans did, supposedly time travelling and orchestrating plans to create a time paradox(going back to change their future), if you haven't actually survived?

I think you misread something. The Thalan claim to be from a dying universe, not from a fully destroyed one.

Case in point, here are some excerpts from the description of two techs in the Thalan tech tree of GalCiv 2:

Temporal Mechanics 

"Our universe exists in 11 dimensions. There are also a near-infinite number of universes that are connected to each of those 11 dimensions. Destroying a universe is a non-trivial effort. And yet, somehow, the primitive species of this space time have managed to do just that. Specifically, the species known as humans, in their near-future, manage to create such utter destruction that the resulting ruin feeds upon itself and permeates all of creation throughout every dimension.
The only bright side to this is that this destruction travels at the speed of light. The downside is that the destruction moves at the speed of light through folded space which means it will engulf the universe in far less than the 13 billion of their years that it would otherwise require."

Xeno Colonization

"In our time, in a dying universe, the ability to exist on the surface of planets in an unprotected environment is unthinkable." 

Plus, here is an excerpt from the the Thalan entry in the Databanks:

"The Thalan are a large insectoid race that claim to come from the near future. In that future, humans have destroyed most of the life in the galaxy and so damaged the fabric of space that the universe itself is beginning to collapse upon itself. The Thalan claim to have come back in time to stop the human “crusade.”"

As for the Thalan themselves, I think they are exactly what they claim to be. The source of Brad's "one man’s “destroy” is another man’s “transform”" doesn't leave much room for doubt:

"The Thalan, in fact, are actually a race of beings from a parallel universe who have figured out the means to travel to other universes and managed to enter our universe at a point before the humans destroyed the universe"
End of Gaunathor's quote

 

An interesting read and you're right, I probably did misread it. It does clarify some things. I always thought Thalans claimed to be from a reality they escaped moments before complete destruction, for instance. Nevertheless, I made the post, having in mind twists of plot in many trilogies that often come along or are revealed in third-parters.

Considering this is what their claims are and one can consider it, not that hard fact(unless it does become so in game of course), there is in my mind some space for such speculation. Maybe it's unfounded and certainly we shall know within 2 years from now, as it looks a possibility this is the last of GC we shall see(though this could be fluid and depends on receptivity/sales of the game I suppose), but its a gut feeling of mine that Brad is having some surprises waiting for us along the way -- or maybe its just what seems to be open ending of the game, including at least 3 versions of  a possible future. But I do confess I'm excited by the prospect of getting GC3. Maybe I'm just getting carried away, lol!

Reply #11 from GalCiv3 Forums Top

I can write some lore for you gaunathor.

Once there was a civilization... the end.

 

Great story, yes? I put alot of time into it.

Reply #12 from GalCiv3 Forums Top

Quoting DARCA1213, reply 11



Once there was a civilization... the end.

 

End of DARCA1213's quote

 

Posting this in the galciv wiki.

Reply #13 from GalCiv3 Forums Top

... we know little about Thalans and one of the things we know is that they haven't evolved yet in GC universe(we haven't seen a proto-Thalan race yet anywhere in GC Cosmos), so where do they really come from? Are they some kind of deity? Are they an abnormality of the Universe, not supposed to happen at all? Are they liars? How do we know anything they say is true? Just cause they say it? ...


So what are your thoughts?

End of quote

Conversation with a Thanan:

 

Interviewer: Whats the most important thing we should know about Thalans?"

Thalan:  "We always lie."

;)

Reply #14 from GalCiv3 Forums Top

It would be interesting in a later game to find out they were just con men that just got lucky when they invented terror stars to have something to blow up and save the universe. This does also open up a concept for a minor faction of Thalans seperate from the major faction of Thalans. There is a possibility that they came from a paralell world that is similar, but different from our own. I guess we will probably find out in a future game. These are definatly mod ideas.

Reply #15 from GalCiv3 Forums Top

Here's an interesting possibility.

Suppose the Drengin have conquered the universe. What do they need? Slavelings. And they would also like to feel all-powerful. Bioengineering their own custom race would solve both problems. The Thalans are insectoid. Insects work, and work hard.

Now. Suppose the Terran "Crusade" keeps the Drengin from conquering the universe. The Thalans would be erased from history. They would never exist. This could be construed as an "alternate universe" or "the road not taken". To the Thalans, keeping the Drengin in power would be a matter of more than survival.

Reply #16 from GalCiv3 Forums Top

Quoting MacModder, reply 15

Here's an interesting possibility.

Suppose the Drengin have conquered the universe. What do they need? Slavelings. And they would also like to feel all-powerful. Bioengineering their own custom race would solve both problems. The Thalans are insectoid. Insects work, and work hard.

Now. Suppose the Terran "Crusade" keeps the Drengin from conquering the universe. The Thalans would be erased from history. They would never exist. This could be construed as an "alternate universe" or "the road not taken". To the Thalans, keeping the Drengin in power would be a matter of more than survival.
End of MacModder's quote

The Thalans have made it clear from the beginning that it's Humanity that destroys reality, or at least heavily damages it.

Reply #17 from GalCiv3 Forums Top

Quoting ParagonRenegade, reply 16
The Thalans have made it clear from the beginning that it's Humanity that destroys reality, or at least heavily damages it.
End of ParagonRenegade's quote

At least as they see it. This could be another of those "point of view" things.

 

Edit.  changed "a they see it" to "as they see it". Yep. a legitimate typo. Which only proves again how important peer proofreading is.

Reply #18 from GalCiv3 Forums Top

I'm confused. Do you mean "as" like the word.

you made a grammar error friend. :)

Reply #19 from GalCiv3 Forums Top

What I don't understand is how the Thalans destroyed the Terror Star plans. Out of the hundreds of thousands of people that must have been involved in a project with such massive scope, no one had a backup copy on their thumb drive?

Reply #20 from GalCiv3 Forums Top

At the time it was the remnant of the Arcean fleets and 2nd earth fleet.  And i highly dough a project like a "death star" would fit on a flash drive.  If you took out the original Blueprints there might not have been a backup.   These were war vessels not science ships with large data banks.  Even so its likely portions of the plans remain. Constructors had to at lest know what they were doing.