EvilSalmon

Join Date 03/2007

6th Playthough + Shipyard Feedback

On my 6th playthrough I spent the time to notice each building, and saw that many of the buildings you unlock replace the "standard" version. I'm sure if I wasn't just trying to fly through the tech tree I may have noticed this sooner, but it highlighted a potential feature that can be added.

- A graphical division between the "standard" buildings. Aka. The ones you can build multiple of the same on a single planet, the ones you can build only one of per planet, and the ones you can build only 1 per empire. Imagine not knowing that the singularity powerplant is on one planet only on your first play-through you build it on a planet that isn't your industrial Juggernaut but on a small backwater planet... having to destroy it so you can place it on the one you intended...

On to the Shipyard

Qualifier:

I am not artistically inclined. I, and others, have said I have a great, weird and wonderful imagination, but I have a disconnect between what my brain can visualize and what my hands can actualize. This may be due to a complete lack of practice, experience, or some form of artistic retardation I was born with... Who knows, and I don't care.

I also have virtually no experience with photoshop or any other special effects or 3d program. Perhaps this is due to the former artistic handicap. I've never given it much thought.

I'm staying this so my review is in the correct context. I'm sure MANY people have similar limitations who will end up buying this game.

The review/impressions:

1) I often forgot what module I had just selected on the selection screen, previously, 2 times ago etc. A minor visual indicator to aid this would help. For example: The last three selected modules may glow with a different intensity/brightness or something strongest with the one I just selected and placed decreasing for the previous 2 before that and no effect on any others. A quick aid incase I wanted to say "fuck it. I liked the one before this one" or "where was the one I just used again, I need another!"

2) I found the modules grouped in the selection menu were not exactly together, claw like ones were spaced out with bulbous fuel tank looking things between them. with spindly wings or antennas in between arcing knife like modules. On the top of the module menu for each size class(where all the modules are) a "group by size" "Group by appearance" sometimes I think "hey another swooping blade like the one I just used. I'll use that" only to find out it's 10 times the size.

3) MY GOD is attaching these modules to each other a frustrating and time consuming task!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Engines pointing up perpendicular to the direction I want them to face, and watching as all the weird and wonderful angles are becoming options except the one I am after. after 5 minutes of moving my mouse around saying "STUPID ENGINEERS!" it suddenly lines up only to shift before I can click to place it.

I would very much like to be able to select points prior on the placed modules so I can attach it to them and not all the other ones I had no interest in using.
Once I attach a module I'd want to be able to click onto it rotate it easily into proper alignment, slide it to one of the adjacent points without having the alignment go out the window
Selecting a few points in a chain so-to-speak by holding say SHIFT while I click on them to make a path I want some other item to fit on. I could select a few points or chains as independent from each and have them colour coded red blue green so I can try those points in succession with a new module or attach subsequent modules to them.

4) The ability to place modules away from the main ship I'm making, look at them, study the points, build components onto them, copy them, modify them, select attachment points etc. BEFORE I attach them to the main ship. I write essays using several independent paragraphs to capture my ideas then I work towards linking them. I want t0 build a ship in a similar manner. Don't let me "Publish a ship" if parts are not connected and are floating by themselves. Hell I may even link parts with an energy effect like a speed racer later on if I can't figure out a visually appealing way to connect them. BUT being able to work on different components separate from each other would make it so much easier for complicated designs.

5) I feel the mouse is being underutilized. When I click and hold the left button and drag, click the right button, use the mouse wheel etc. the most common controls being used would be helpful, and have such button combinations easily customizable. Say there is a button on the top left of the screen that says "assign to hotkey" and I use a feature, click assign button and then do some combination with the mouse it is loaded into that hotkey

6) I often had modules being doubled up on one side of a ship I was making and not the other, Making for some weird ass looking design choices I didn't enjoy.... I had no idea what "feature" was causing it and on what module it was activated...

When I select a module I'd like to see highlighted, glowing or something what features are active on that module. If I have symmetry, flip, double up, axis stuff on for that mod or not... That way I can undo or copy the effects to another.

7) WHERE is the REDO AND UNDO FEATURE!

8) I would like to be able to "UNDO, UNDO, UNDO, UNDO, UNDO, UNDO, UNDO" to get back into the bowels of a design, delete a mod, change it etc. and then "redo, redo, redo, redo" to get back where I am. Sure it may not work on major structural modules that everything else was attached to, but on small little saucers that have nothing else attached to them, or glowing effects. I can swap that out without having to remember all the steps I had made after.

9) I'd like to be able to use the standard modules, combine them into stuff, and save them as my own custom modules I can select later without having to rebuild them. My race may prefer spiky contraptions, or bulbous things and I can save time by having pre-made ones saved.

10) I had an issue on my first build that I had to change something on one of the first modules I had placed. I ran into limitations and had to change it, but there was no way to select the module. a separate screen that has a list of modules beginning with the first and flow-charting out. When I select a module in the flowchart it is highlighted and the others turn transparent. I can then select it easily, make changes and any problems it causes can be highlighted in red.

I'm sure that after I use this design tool in the game I'll get more proficient with it, but the longer and steeper the learning curve the fewer people will invest the time into it to create great ships. Involving as many people of abilities, and patience as possible can only mean more players are engaged, immersed and enjoying the feature. All things that increases fun-value, recommendations to friends and purchasing DLC

I'll give the builder a try again in a few days and add to the review.

Cheers for reading my humble opinions.

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Played with the Shipyard function a bit more. I have more thoughts

1) Titanium plating is a small module that sticks to the side of the ship...... I mean that's pretty idiotic. Titanium plating should be a selection you choose and it "plates" the entire ship. Not just some tiny tiny object on the side of the ship... Some thought to how technology is applied to the ships is needed eventually. Some tech simply looks foolish as a single tiny module to stick to some random part of the ship.

2) I was in the middle of a 2 hour design marathon making a COOL large ship, and I ended up not being able to place anymore modules. My ship was about 80% finished I was guessing then... Nope you can't place anymore shit. Talk about a disappointing experience... Finally getting the things looking the way I wanted them to, was figuring out a way to make the ship taper towards the engines while being aesthetically pleasing. Then BOOM NO MORE MODS FOR YOU!

There really shouldn't be a limit in the number of modules. Give us a class limit. I'm thinking that even a genuine huge design (when huge ships are implemented) I'll end up not being able to place all the modules I want... If I'm making a Tiny ship using tiny tech limit all modules to Tiny, but let me place as MANY as I want. Don't stunt my burgeoning artistic ability. Design after all doesn't have much to do with functionality of a ship. That's the tech we place on it not the aesthetic components.

I would upload a screenshot, but It doesn't let me. I will not be uploading it to some other website so I can link it here. It's on my desktop, and if I can't upload it so be it. The world will just have to be a poorer place (yeah right) for not being able to view my artistic ability.

The design process is painfully slow... I mean I got significantly closer to retirement trying this shit out... Something has to be done to let us move modules around, easily access attachment points, change points, make other modules transparent... something, anything... everything. Please

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Quoting EvilSalmon,

reply 1

From a technical standpoint, I'm pretty confident there needs to be a module limit since once you are done with your master piece, presumably you want to actually play with it. Which means the game now has to render numerous copies of that ship. A ship with 10,000 modules would end up bringing the game to a grinding halt.

That said, I'm curious how many modules you are talking as I've spent a fair amount of time building ships so far and I haven't run into a limit.

Quoting ,

quoting post

1) I often forgot what module I had just selected on the selection screen, previously, 2 times ago etc.

2) I found the modules grouped in the selection menu were not exactly together, claw like ones were spaced out with bulbous fuel tank looking things between them. with spindly wings or antennas in between arcing knife like modules.

3) MY GOD is attaching these modules to each other a frustrating and time consuming task!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

4) The ability to place modules away from the main ship I'm making, look at them, study the points, build components onto them, copy them, modify them, select attachment points etc. BEFORE I attach them to the main ship. I write essays using several independent paragraphs to capture my ideas then I work towards linking them. I want t0 build a ship in a similar manner. Don't let me "Publish a ship" if parts are not connected and are floating by themselves. Hell I may even link parts with an energy effect like a speed racer later on if I can't figure out a visually appealing way to connect them. BUT being able to work on different components separate from each other would make it so much easier for complicated designs.

5) I feel the mouse is being underutilized. When I click and hold the left button and drag, click the right button, use the mouse wheel etc. the most common controls being used would be helpful, and have such button combinations easily customizable. Say there is a button on the top left of the screen that says "assign to hotkey" and I use a feature, click assign button and then do some combination with the mouse it is loaded into that hotkey

6) I often had modules being doubled up on one side of a ship I was making and not the other, Making for some weird ass looking design choices I didn't enjoy.... I had no idea what "feature" was causing it and on what module it was activated...

When I select a module I'd like to see highlighted, glowing or something what features are active on that module. If I have symmetry, flip, double up, axis stuff on for that mod or not... That way I can undo or copy the effects to another.

7) WHERE is the REDO AND UNDO FEATURE!

8) I would like to be able to "UNDO, UNDO, UNDO, UNDO, UNDO, UNDO, UNDO" to get back into the bowels of a design, delete a mod, change it etc. and then "redo, redo, redo, redo" to get back where I am. Sure it may not work on major structural modules that everything else was attached to, but on small little saucers that have nothing else attached to them, or glowing effects. I can swap that out without having to remember all the steps I had made after.

9) I'd like to be able to use the standard modules, combine them into stuff, and save them as my own custom modules I can select later without having to rebuild them. My race may prefer spiky contraptions, or bulbous things and I can save time by having pre-made ones saved.

10) I had an issue on my first build that I had to change something on one of the first modules I had placed. I ran into limitations and had to change it, but there was no way to select the module. a separate screen that has a list of modules beginning with the first and flow-charting out. When I select a module in the flowchart it is highlighted and the others turn transparent. I can then select it easily, make changes and any problems it causes can be highlighted in red.

1) While not exactly what you are asking for, the modules are labeled/named. You can hover over your build list on the bottom to see the name of the module, then find that name in the list.

2) GalCiv 2 had the same issue. Not saying it wouldn't be nice to have them grouped or sorted somehow, but I wouldn't hold your breath.

3) Can you elaborate?

4) From a technical standpoint that sounds like a pain in the ass to implement for a relatively minor feature of the game. This is Galactic Civilizations, not AutoDesk Ship Builder 2014. I would far rather them focus on fixing the actual bugs/glitches of the shipyard. But, that's just my opinion.

5) Hot keys to do what?

6) Again, can you elaborate? Meaning you clicked once and it placed two modules, or what?

7) Agreed.

8) So you want to be able to rewind your design, make a change to a core piece, then have it automatically reapply the modules you had previously added? How exactly would this work? Different modules have different hardpoints. If you change a module, it has no way of knowing where those pieces you removed should go. I don't see this as being technically possible.

9) That would be a handy feature to be sure, but again from a technical standpoint it doesn't seem practical to implement but that's up to the dev's.

10) This sounds like basically the same item as number 8. You want to be able to swap out a module and then have the game automatically figure out where to reattached everything?

I get what you are saying with all of this and I even agree on a few points. But on most of them, as an engineer, my response is "things don't work that way". While it would be great if 3D modelling was like on Iron Man, it's not.

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