Cutom Races? » Forum Post by The

I certainly hope custom races return, using the new ideologies system.

In GC2 I tried recreating the Vong from Star Wars but couldn't find any way to give them attributes that would do them justice - they are supposed to consider mechanical technology blasphemy.

"We do not live side by side with impurity. Your civilization is built on abominations. Your galaxy is polluted. We have come to cleanse it, so that others besides our warrior caste may occupy it and live cleanly here. It is our destiny..."

Instead, they allied with the Yor.

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Heheh... the irony!

It'd be cool if you could set certain conditions and ideologies for them, like hatred of mechanical lifeforms so that the races has a massive diplomatic penalty for dealing with them. That'd work for other people, like someone trying to do the League from the backstory to Dune, the remnants of Free Humanity who fought the Butlerian Jihad against the Thinking Machines.

I had a race called the Sithrimni who were telepathic and had a Group Mind (not a Hive Mind ala The Borg) and who were good spies and culture people... I basically just ended up playing them as Krynn. It'd be nice to have an expansion to the psychic bits of the tech tree, like the altarians who had telepathic defence tech and such.

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Something like the MoO2 attributes page would be cool, so that you could make a robotic race, a repulsive race or an aquatic race. Would be pretty neat.

If I'm barred from making my hyper-warlike band of monks, I'll be mad.

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tid242

Join Date 04/2008

+63

One of the things that I found particularly annoying about custom races in GC2 was that when you chose a tech tree you were in a race with whomever's tech tree that was for the "galactic achievements" in that tree. So if you chose the Krynn tech tree, all of the Krynn-only gal achievements would not be Krynn-only, they were [Krynn + you]-only. So you were in this sort of automatic race for normal race techs that if you were playing, say, Krynn Couns you normally wouldn't be.

The only way around this was to go in and mod your own tech tree just to change the names of these things - which is a really ineloquent fix to a problem that really shouldn't exist. Or choose not to play against the race that has the same tech tree that you chose (which eliminates you from choosing "random").

So... if using a custom race, and choosing a different race's tech tree, there should at least be a toggle for "tech tree unique to your race" so that this isn't a problem.

We'll see how these features are implemented in GC3 as I'm sure that this annoying facet of designing your own race hasn't been lost by stardock...

-tid242

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I wouldn't expect that faccet to be lost. I would say that the small race tech tree is your best solution. I did like the small race tech tree; even though I would like to see more custom tech trees. I would like to see some custom super abilities. I would like to see more abilities. The first problem I find with the abilities is that they r not on par with the stock races. I understand about the Thalans, but what about the other species. I would like to see a negative ability option so I can minus abilities to gain more points is other areas. I would I would like to be able to gain the same starting techs as anyone else but the Thalans. Sometimes a stock race skips a tech in the path where u would have to pick one to get the other tech. The reason I don't include the Thalans is because they came from the future. Not because I don't like the racial picts now I always like more. I would like to have a race editor similar to spore except I would like to include the human option. I also don't think they give me enough options to make aliens. I would like to make it easier to make descent aliens. I would like to include an option to make specific features like u do on Greatest heavyweights, or boxing legends of the ring from sega genesis. I want the ability to pick what space clothes my species will have. I want to see some custom flagship models.

+1

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It would be nice to pick and mix techs, like the dark energy 'magic' techs of the Altarians or Drath with a different tech tree, I'd especially like the ability to add penalties to my race's stats so I can get better bonuses in other things - a lot f my custom races would, in-universe, have several powerful weaknesses but several more powerful strengths, like the aforementioned crippling population growth problem - limiting expansion and ground combat, but at the same time having an easier time developing the few colonies they have and being better at research

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Gaunathor

Join Date 04/2006

+170

Quoting tid242,

reply 4

One of the things that I found particularly annoying about custom races in GC2 was that when you chose a tech tree you were in a race with whomever's tech tree that was for the "galactic achievements" in that tree.

Hold on, you're using another race's tech tree for your custom race, and are now complaining, that you share the same GAs with them? What did you expect would happen?

Quoting tid242,

reply 4

So... if using a custom race, and choosing a different race's tech tree, there should at least be a toggle for "tech tree unique to your race" so that this isn't a problem.

I can't see such a toggle happening, but if it did, it would only rename the tech tree, not fix your problem. The InternalName of the techs would need to be changed in order to do that. However, you would also need to make copies of the buildings, change their InternalName, and give them the new tech name as prerequisite. Otherwise, you wouldn't unlock them, after you've researched the techs.

You honestly can't expect the game to do all of that for you. How would it know what techs to rename, or what buildings (and other items) are affected and need to be changed too?

Sorry, but, if you want a new tech tree and everything that goes along with that, you'll have to make it yourself. I doubt, that this will change in GalCiv 3.

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WIllythemailboy

Join Date 03/2006

+70

Quoting Gaunathor,

reply 7

.

I think he was asking more for a "random civs but exclude the one who's tech tree I'm using" button.

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Quoting The_Tsurani,

reply 6

It would be nice to pick and mix techs, like the dark energy 'magic' techs of the Altarians or Drath with a different tech tree, I'd especially like the ability to add penalties to my race's stats so I can get better bonuses in other things - a lot f my custom races would, in-universe, have several powerful weaknesses but several more powerful strengths, like the aforementioned crippling population growth problem - limiting expansion and ground combat, but at the same time having an easier time developing the few colonies they have and being better at research

How about being able to create a custom race by picking characteristics from a menu, and having tech trees that mix and combine based on the characteristics you choose (with one or more basic trees as well).

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Quoting Lucky Jack,

reply 9

Quoting The_Tsurani, reply 6
It would be nice to pick and mix techs, like the dark energy 'magic' techs of the Altarians or Drath with a different tech tree, I'd especially like the ability to add penalties to my race's stats so I can get better bonuses in other things - a lot f my custom races would, in-universe, have several powerful weaknesses but several more powerful strengths, like the aforementioned crippling population growth problem - limiting expansion and ground combat, but at the same time having an easier time developing the few colonies they have and being better at research

How about being able to create a custom race by picking characteristics from a menu, and having tech trees that mix and combine based on the characteristics you choose (with one or more basic trees as well).

Well when I wrote my post I considered the first paragraph, and then decided not to write it. Both ideas sound like a good idea.

Quoting Gaunathor,

reply 7

Quoting tid242, reply 4One of the things that I found particularly annoying about custom races in GC2 was that when you chose a tech tree you were in a race with whomever's tech tree that was for the "galactic achievements" in that tree.

Hold on, you're using another race's tech tree for your custom race, and are now complaining, that you share the same GAs with them? What did you expect would happen?

I really agree U r using some one else's tech tree what would u expect, but to share galactic achievements and trade goods. If this is a problem then Galactic civilizations have found a solution with thusie minor race tech tree. This is made for different races to share the same resourses. I think there should be more of these. I can understand about always customising with the same tech tree. If u don't always pick the same races then there is another solution use the trees U don't use. The game does seem to play the dominion of korx better to my opinion on customising. If your wondering what I am talking about I was customising a lot of options awhile ago pitting them against each other computer wise. The best Ai's usually were the Generic and the Krynn

Quoting tid242, reply 4So... if using a custom race, and choosing a different race's tech tree, there should at least be a toggle for "tech tree unique to your race" so that this isn't a problem.

You honestly can't expect the game to do all of that for you. How would it know what techs to rename, or what buildings (and other items) are affected and need to be changed too?

Sorry, but, if you want a new tech tree and everything that goes along with that, you'll have to make it yourself. I doubt, that this will change in GalCiv 3.[/quote]

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Quoting Lucky Jack,

reply 9

Quoting The_Tsurani, reply 6
It would be nice to pick and mix techs, like the dark energy 'magic' techs of the Altarians or Drath with a different tech tree, I'd especially like the ability to add penalties to my race's stats so I can get better bonuses in other things - a lot f my custom races would, in-universe, have several powerful weaknesses but several more powerful strengths, like the aforementioned crippling population growth problem - limiting expansion and ground combat, but at the same time having an easier time developing the few colonies they have and being better at research

How about being able to create a custom race by picking characteristics from a menu, and having tech trees that mix and combine based on the characteristics you choose (with one or more basic trees as well).

I quite like this idea. Endless Space has something similar - you pick various bonuses and penalties for your race, each worth a certain number of points (plus or minus depending of if it's a bonus or penalty, of course) though you still had to base your ships and race picture on one of the factions, and the ship appearance was linked to the racial bonuses, like to have Sophon ship design, you also *had* to have the Sophon racial bonuses and penalties as well, in addition to the characteristics you chose. Though as far as I know, the tech tree was the same across all races.

This ship design and forced racial bonus issues won't be a problem in GalCiv, since that's not how they do things... but having a list of characteristics to choose from that affect the technologies you can research would be beyond cool.

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Quoting michaelwhittaker,

reply 10

Quoting Gaunathor, reply 7

Quoting The_Tsurani, reply 6
It would be nice to pick and mix techs, like the dark energy 'magic' techs of the Altarians or Drath with a different tech tree, I'd especially like the ability to add penalties to my race's stats so I can get better bonuses in other things - a lot f my custom races would, in-universe, have several powerful weaknesses but several more powerful strengths, like the aforementioned crippling population growth problem - limiting expansion and ground combat, but at the same time having an easier time developing the few colonies they have and being better at research

How about being able to create a custom race by picking characteristics from a menu, and having tech trees that mix and combine based on the characteristics you choose (with one or more basic trees as well).

Well when I wrote my post I considered the first paragraph, and then decided not to write it. Both ideas sound like a good idea.

Quoting Gaunathor, reply 7

Quoting tid242, reply 4One of the things that I found particularly annoying about custom races in GC2 was that when you chose a tech tree you were in a race with whomever's tech tree that was for the "galactic achievements" in that tree.

Hold on, you're using another race's tech tree for your custom race, and are now complaining, that you share the same GAs with them? What did you expect would happen?

I[/quote] really agree U r using some one else's tech tree what would u expect, but to share galactic achievements and trade goods. If this is a problem then Galactic civilizations have found a solution with thusie minor race tech tree. This is made for different races to share the same resourses. I think there should be more of these. I can understand about always customising with the same tech tree. If u don't always pick the same races then there is another solution use the trees U don't use. The game does seem to play the dominion of korx better to my opinion on customising. If your wondering what I am talking about I was customising a lot of options awhile ago pitting them against each other computer wise. The best Ai's usually were the Generic and the Krynn.

Getting back to the tech tree I think it is a better solution to use the Minor race tech trees, or use tech trees that aren't going to be played rather than pitting the same race against the other. It may b just as fruitful to use the Ai though.

Someone from stardock may swear under their breath for this, but I'm going to suggest. This will really only get u a little gain for a lot of work, but I would actually consider this for the Thalans that don't really have planetary improvements at least at the beginning of the game, so I'm also going to include an improvememt option. You would create 13 different database. 12 of them would classify the Galactic achievements, Trade goods. planetary improvements, and one per planet improvements of the stock races. 1 database would have what would have to be decided on what is a generic version of these classifications. What would happen is that u could have an option to switch the latter option with the stock races. This would avoid a cheesiness that using a race specific Galactic achievements and trade goods would bring by making multiple versions of what the game would only have one. If u do this please make this an option u could opt out of. I want to point out that this might be a nice option when going the other ways would weaken opponents like having 5 Thalans on the game I tried that. It doesn't work the way u would think; because galactic acheivements prevent this. First it devides what was made to be unified, then it weakens the opponents that don't get them.

Quoting tid242, reply 4So... if using a custom race, and choosing a different race's tech tree, there should at least be a toggle for "tech tree unique to your race" so that this isn't a problem.

You honestly can't expect the game to do all of that for you. How would it know what techs to rename, or what buildings (and other items) are affected and need to be changed too?

Sorry, but, if you want a new tech tree and everything that goes along with that, you'll have to make it yourself. I doubt, that this will change in GalCiv 3.
[/quote]

I do agree it would be to much work for a little fruit, but I suggested how and why this could be done anyways.

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