ThunderNipples

Join Date 01/2008

Too Many Promises, Too Few Players?

While I love RTS games and the Homeworld series, this game looks like another failure on the rise. I hope that the creators have an idea of how they plan to pull players into this game and keep them around. Complaints and doubt about the Lobby area are already coming out at all the gaming websites

I know it will take more than 'new maps, new units, and a great new system of strategy gameplay' to keep people around, look at how fast games like Supreme Commander lost its crowd! Every game I have played like this in the past has failed to keep players coming. They play for a few weeks and are never seen again and the game dies.

The graphics look incredible, which always creates problems; especially for online players! It also immediately drives away new players who start having trouble running the game whenever they want to play, especially online.

So what does the SoaSE system offer that can keep players active, happy, and will keep us from abandoning another RTS game?!

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Yarlen

Join Date 01/2005

+367

Perhaps you could provide examples of "Complaints and doubt about the Lobby area are already coming out at all the gaming websites"? The only complaints I've seen were from GameSpy and we've implemented most of their suggestions.

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Welcome to the Forum, ThunderNipples.
We all know the Lobby sucks, and is usually empty atm, mostly because it sucks, but keep in mind this is only beta. Stardock has kept a strict limit on the number of players in the pool, so finding a game is going to be tough. Plus, with a look at the new screenshots, posted just today, huge sections of the AI have been totally reworked, so I'm confident that the Lobby is among them. (Yarlen, please confirm).

As far as what it offers that other RTS's don't, Id say its strategic depth. There are simply more ways to accomplish your strategic goals in SoaSE than in most other RTS. Granted, tactical options may be a little more limited, but not by much. Online MP games are little better than a crapshoot anyways. Some get lucky and last for years, while other just whither and die in months, with little in concrete reasons for either.

As for the graphics being too good for online play, thats just ridiculous. Nobody says that about UT3, probably the prettiest game out there atm. If GPU lag is bogging you down, just turn the detail down. Sins scales exceptionally well.

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Yarlen

Join Date 01/2005

+367

The ICO Lobby and functionality of it have been overhauled from what's in Beta 4. Ironclad plans to continue improving it past release as well.

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Saw the comment on IGN.com and Gamespy.com (pretty much the same company)

I understand that a game like this probably wont be perfect when it hits the shelves, but it's not just the Lobby problems that concern me. Like I said in my first post, I'm worried more about buying the game, liking it, but having nobody to play it with.

I want to know what is going to keep the players coming back. It looks a lot like a standard RTS hyped up in 4X; but I dont see a lot of 'genuine' or 'creative' ideas (with the exception of the whole "bounty" idea, NICE).

Just wanna help this game become "All it can be" because I dont wanna shell out another $60 on something that will die in a few months.

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you havent done your full fledged browsing then. this game is not the standard "hyped up" RTS.

in any case I can see your possible issues with the number of players, but keep in mind that as of current the only players are beta folk, and even then getting a match going isnt hard if you know where to look. check SDC #sins to see where the beta community hangs out.

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kryo

Join Date 05/2003

+458

The IGN preview was based on beta 4, which only contains a bare-bones lobby so beta testers could get games up and do the "real" testing. As Yarlen said, it's been completely redone for release, and as Schod notes, most beta players arrange games on IRC since it's easier to pop in and see what's going on.

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I wish I had the Beta version so I could offer up more. Too bad for me

but I'd be happy to take a Beta spot and build a fansite for this game

I'll throw in a few tips if anyone wants to stick them into this great looking game:

- Company of Heroes has held a strong crowd and has a lot of great features that almost always keep the game moving (rushing, tech levels, defensive/offensive balance, choice of special abilities for each army, great interaction b/w units and environment, ect.) This game is exciting throughout a match, even at the very beginning you must always try to get leverage on an opponent.

- Supreme Commander had a nice control system and a decent, but confusing for some, economics setup.

- Homeworld was one of the best RTS games ever made, but could be very slow. I hope that Sins will offer constant action throughout matches and not the standard RTS build delays we always must suffer through. "Quick Moves" that can be made throughout the matches, with little or lots of resources, would be really nice!

Give me a Beta... please

Nice discussions here, thanks to all for the quick responses!

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Though the amount of time games take might drive away some elements of competition, I think this game will always retain a modest player base(sure it wont be Warcraft or Starcraft), but it will also be a pretty robust community. The gem will in my opinion be the amount of variety and differance with each, not to mention the modibility, I think that we will see many spin off mods and even RPG maps(thanks to caps) that players design with the map editor and mod tools.

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Nothing will ever be Warcraft or Starcraft again, but a lot of that has to do with the time when they were released and the fact that these games were great in their time and had time to build up massive crouds and keep them. These days an RTS must offer creative and smooth gameplay without scarring away new players. This game is starting to look a lot like the "Homeworld scenerio" where a great game, with great ideas and gameplay, turns away big crouds because it is too powerful and too much to handle for its time.

The gem will in my opinion be the amount of variety and differance with each, not to mention the modibility, I think that we will see many spin off mods and even RPG maps(thanks to caps) that players design with the map editor and mod tools.

But you must have a good crowd before players will put time and effort into making things for a game. After all, somebody wont make something if it is rarely going to be used/played.

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But you must have a good crowd before players will put time and effort into making things for a game. After all, somebody wont make something if it is rarely going to be used/played.

We already have a large crowd of modders present. All we need now is the crowd to play the mods and maps.

This game is starting to look a lot like the "Homeworld scenerio" where a great game, with great ideas and gameplay, turns away big crouds because it is too powerful and too much to handle for its time.

Though Sins is a little more complex then homeworld, it is a lot more streamlined and in easier to use. Plus the lack of excessive microing helps keep the game more relaxed and a lot more simpler once basic mechanics are understood.

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Sounds good so far!

How long does it take an advanced RTS player, like me, to learn the mechanics.

How long for a new RTS player?

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You should be able to play comfortably in your first sitting, pick up a handlful of reliable strategies within a day or two, and spend months perfecting multiplayer strategy and become a highly efficient player

"Easy to learn, Hard to Master" probably sums the game up best.

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In regards to OP hmmmm

Difficult yet extremely valid question!

However i must say i am positive about future of this title - mainly because it looks great, i am positive it will play great too and most importantly this is NOT your typical AAA mega hyped title...

I find recently that hyped games are the ones that die fastest so here is to many moons of fun with Sins!

eeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

So say we all...

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i think that if stardock follow through with decent modding tools, the game AND the current community will draw even more people,

i think thats what let supreme commander down is that they said we would get mod tools and all we really got in the end was a buggy map editor, I and many others felt let down and my interest in modding the game was sucked away

Kenetor

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but your still doing it kentor

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Blair Fraser

Join Date 10/2006

+292

People have been modding Sins since March even without tools (we will release most of our in house tools after release). To be honest, for most of the stuff all you need is notepad. Some people have already created a map tool, a map sharing tool and a mesh editor not to mention lots of new art, abilities, weapons etc. And for most of them, they are holding back until release to really go to town on modding.

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on that subject what tools are we actuly getting when will we get a list type thing? (now would be nice

)

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Great topic indeed. Lately all games i played, dont catch me as some games did before.
After play couple days it gets really boring to keep playing.

Now this game is looking really tight, might be the game i have been waiting and our clan, after Ground control II.

Cant wait for February!

eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

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ThunderNipples, let me put it this way:

I have been chasing this game around since I first heard about it in November of 2005... And I haven't tired of it yet.

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ThunderNipples, let me put it this way:

I have been chasing this game around since I first heard about it in November of 2005... And I haven't tired of it yet.

This is great to hear!

Hope i shall feel the same in 2010

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RonLugge

Join Date 05/2004

+50

And for most of them, they are holding back until release to really go to town on modding.

True... given that the file formats will inevitably change up until release (hopefully not to much after release, or you could follow the idea SEIV finally took and append version-based file reading, so it will "remember" how to read older file formats...) most people want to wait to start the hard work of coding their new mods

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*claps outrageously*
true mastery of the obvious Ron!
*salutes*

Hope i shall feel the same in 2010

oh you shall! especially considering how little of the game we got for all this time.

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yep, if you go to https://www.sins.bz/forum/index.php you can find videos and mods. It helps keep everything interesting.

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AND the current community will draw even more people,

Well I think that if we all try to put on our happy faces a little more we won't actually end up scaring people away.

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we already had our hapy faces on tge ,hadent you noticed?

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